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Episode 290

Americans just want a Bud LIght

Ryan Walters pays the piper, politicians don't want Oklahomans to propose ballot initiatives, and we discuss how well the parties are (or are not) connecting with voters.

Links mentioned:

Transcript
Andy Moore:

Hello and welcome to Let's Pod This.

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My name is Andy Moore.

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It's good to be with you again this week.

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Friends, I'll apologize off the top.

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I'm a little stuffy.

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All the wind and the dust

and the wildfires has really

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got me a little messed up.

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And I'm sure, like many of

you, are in the same boat.

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I, it feels like everyone I

talk to every day is like,

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these allergies are killing me.

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And politics also slightly killing me.

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And like many of you, I'm sure.

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Happy spring break for those of you

who celebrate, who have kids or jobs

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where you get to take a spring break.

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Happy sunshine week to all of you who

care about government transparency.

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As we highlight almost every

year, the Third week of March is

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historically sunshine week, celebrated

by transparency organizations, and

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most notably, the press, the media.

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Each week even Oklahoma Attorney General

Gittner Drummond had an excellent op

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ed in the Oklahoman about transparency.

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Headline states, transparency

is the heart of democracy.

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Which is true.

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It's at least one of the

valves, primary artery of that.

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In Oklahoma, the A.

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G.

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's office is the Department or

agency that is, I think, primarily

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responsible for enforcing the Open

Records Act and Open Meeting Act.

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They do host trainings around the state.

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I think they had more than 750 people

who attended their trainings this year.

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They often do that in conjunction with the

Oklahoma Press Association and sometimes

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with Freedom of Information, Oklahoma.

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Which is a non profit that

celebrates or champions transparency

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and the First Amendment.

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And in fact, FOI Oklahoma will be hosting

an event about transparency, about the

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Open Records Act, Open Meeting Act, and

its vital importance to our democracy.

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And just the first amendment in general

and that event is going to be next week.

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I believe on Tuesday or Thursday, I

think it's on Thursday the 28th We

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look at my calendar and I'll tell you

it is on nope, I was wrong, it was

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on Tuesday the 25th, March 25th FOI

Oklahoma presents Summit on Threats to

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First Amendment Freedoms from 6 to 8 p.

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m.

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at the Northwest Library in Oklahoma City.

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That's the one, Patience Ladding

Northwest Library, it's at

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MacArthur and 122nd Northwest

122nd, from 6 to 8 in the evening.

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I will be there it should be an

interesting conversation, a good event.

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I think there's going to be a number of

elected officials and other community

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leaders there to really have a, I think

a pretty honest conversation about what

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are the primary threats that we might be

seeing to our First Amendment freedoms.

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There are five freedoms

listed in the First Amendment.

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If you can name them, please send me

an email at podcast at letsfixthis.

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org and we'll give you a sticker.

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Who doesn't love a sticker, right?

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Great.

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You can also find A.

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G.

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Drummond's op ed in the

Oklahoman at theoklahoman.

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com if you feel so inclined.

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So I wanted to start this week with

a brief note just of condolences

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in our hearts are with all of the

victims in Oklahoma from wildfire,

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wildfires over the past week.

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Last weekend, I think in my last

episode, I mentioned that I was headed

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to Stillwater for the Mid South Gravel

Bike Race, which unfortunately was

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cancelled due to the wildfires as we

drove up there on Friday afternoon.

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It was a bizarre trip, right?

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Just, we all remember, like,

the wind was just raging.

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Crosswinds made it difficult to drive.

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The dust in the air gave

everything a bit of a sepia tone.

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And once we turned off of 35 onto

Highway 51 and were headed east into

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Stillwater, about halfway through

there is where we hit the fires.

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And to see large scale wildfires just

running rampant across some of those

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pastures out there was really striking

and it wasn't long before smoke made

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the roads unsafe to travel in the law

enforcement had his reroute and kind

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of take some back roads into town.

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And I think that first night was

Friday night was really anxiety

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provoking for everybody in Stillwater.

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We knew the fires were close.

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We knew that they were blowing

our direction and closing in.

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When we got to our Airbnb, us and our

friends, we didn't unpack because we

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thought we might have to leave again.

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Thankfully we didn't, but as news began

to trickle in as the fires passed and

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we saw the number of homes that were

impacted that night and the next day.

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The event shifted from a 4, 300

person, bike race and running race

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on top of that, to a benefit event.

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I know they've raised over 10, 000 just

from a couple of cyclists that did, like,

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really long 300 mile rides, it's like

a a ride a thon almost, to raise funds.

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A lot of local businesses Stone Cloud

Brewing, some of the event sponsors

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pivoted and made made some contributions

towards helping those in wildfire relief

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into the United Way of Payne County.

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If you are interested in helping victims

of the wildfires in Stillwater or

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Norman or anywhere else in the state

I suggest, looking for trusted sources

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there, or if families directly impacted,

finding ways to give to them directly.

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But groups like United Way, like Red

Cross if you're a Norman Red Dirt Voices

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is a mutual aid organization, or Red Dirt

Collective, excuse me, Red Dirt Collective

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is a mutual aid organization that is doing

a lot of work directly with families.

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They're a great way to give there, so.

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Gosh what a scary weekend.

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I know that, the wind, even through

last night, was still pretty high.

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I think we're experiencing some

high winds coming up in a few days.

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And until we get some, I guess,

like, April showers to dampen things

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again, this dry period, this windy

period, means this is the new normal.

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We can get into a much larger conversation

about climate change and how we arrived

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at this point, and why weather patterns

have perhaps shifted the way they have,

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but that's an episode for another day.

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Let's start with some

updates from last week.

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There were several news stories

that we covered last week.

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That we already have updates on.

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I think some I mentioned

we would, and indeed we do.

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First of all, State Superintendent

Ryan Walters, as we discussed

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last week, had settled an issue

with the Ethics Commission.

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They were also filing some new ones.

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They were sending some to district court.

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But this one in particular, they

mentioned that he had already

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settled, but last week they had

not yet released the terms of that.

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And this is an issue where he was

using his I guess his personal

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Twitter account, but it made it look

like it was an official account.

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It had Superintendent in the name, it

like, it had his official headshot,

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all those things that you might use

on an official government account.

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And the Ethics Commission said,

hey, this is very blurry here.

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You are misleading the public and it

is making it seem like you're using An

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official account for personal purposes,

namely endorsing and supporting or

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opposing political candidates in

some other, like, partisan issues.

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And so, in response, he settled

he has to pay 5, 000 fine, which

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is not huge, but it's not nothing.

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And if it was me and I got fined

5, 000, that's a lot of money.

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He also had to change his profile

photo and his handle, or whatever

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that's called, the at name.

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To keep using it as a personal account.

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And I guess he's done that.

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I don't know.

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I don't actually follow him, because

I don't need that in my life.

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But that's the outcome of that one.

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But then also this week on the new side of

news, a state lawmaker, Ellen Pogemiller,

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representative from House District 88,

whom we had on the show just a few weeks

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ago, actually she has formally requested

that the Attorney General weigh in on

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whether or not Ryan Walter's connection

to this new professional association,

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which is called Teacher Freedom Alliance.

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A representative, Pogue Miller, asked

AG Drummond to quote, clarify the

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legality of Walters conduct concerning

this new Teacher Freedom Alliance.

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She also asked Drummond to

investigate any financial ties and

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contacts between Walters and TFA.

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What's funny to me about this, or

interesting, is that this group,

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Teacher Freedom Alliance, I think

they say that they are a professional

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association or professional organization,

but they really act like A union.

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And I think Walter's rhetoric around

this, he said, like, now there's an

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alternative to the woke teacher unions.

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And anyone who has followed Oklahoma

news for the last several years has seen

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Ryan Walters use the phrase, like, woke

teacher unions, right, a number of times.

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He often characterizes them as

being this, like, arm of the left

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deep state and that they're, like,

indoctrinating teachers, I don't know,

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like, it's all kind of wild stuff.

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Considering that they're a labor union

that just wants public employees, teachers

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and school employees to be appropriately

paid and compensated they, to now be

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aligning with this group that looks

like it's like a stand up organization

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just on the opposite side of the aisle.

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A lot of the rhetoric is definitely

around, um, like using the term

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freedom in the way that, the

Freedom Caucus and this far right

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contingent tend to use that word.

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So we'll see.

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The AG's office has reported that

they've received that request and

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they'll be responding as appropriate.

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So we'll see what happens over

the next few weeks with that.

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Of course, everything here is like a

little pull, a little more political

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than usual because the Attorney

General is running for governor.

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And then rumors are on Ryan

Walters that he's either running

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for governor or running for re

election as state superintendent.

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We don't, none of that has

been formally announced yet.

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But there's this like, I don't know, bias,

expectation, suspicion, something, right?

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About these two guys in the

news that it makes it difficult,

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I think, for voters, right?

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For most of us.

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Like, you want justice to be

served as necessary, right?

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Either people are convicted or exonerated

or punished or set free or whatever.

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It's like the right thing to

do by the letter of the law.

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But as we all know, when politicians

get involved, it gets murky, right?

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Because then there are not just legal

incentives, right versus wrong, there are

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political incentives, how does this play

with my base, my supporters, um, which

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of these groups is going to donate to my

campaign or to support me along the way.

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And that, I think, shifts the incentives

that a lot of these leaders have, right?

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I for one, want our Attorney

General to be incentivized by the

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law, by doing the right thing.

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I want our state superintendent

to be incentivized by doing the

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right thing for public schools.

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That's his job as state superintendent of

public instruction not by political wins.

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I also get, right, realistically,

that what I personally may believe is

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the right thing for Oklahoma's public

schools may be different than what

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Superintendent Walters believes to be

right for Oklahoma's public schools.

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That, again, is a much larger

conversation for another episode.

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I just do think it's funny, just to come

back to, like, that this Teacher Freedom

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Alliance, like, really looks and is acting

like a teacher's union, but we know that

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Walters hates unions, so Who are they?

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What are they?

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Are they a think tank?

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I saw them described as a

think tank in one write up.

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And so, I'll be very curious.

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Also, whenever new groups like this

pop up, especially around, like,

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in the close proximity to elected

officials, I get a little suspicious.

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And it sounds like Representative

Pogemiller might be a

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little suspicious as well.

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I guess we'll find out.

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Also last week, we discussed a law that

is going through the process this year

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that addresses, we'll say, immigration.

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That's a broad term for this, but that's

what it's about, and it seeks to fiddle

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with a a law that was passed last year

that was pretty contentious, and this

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that deals with a, what they called,

quote, impermissible occupation, right?

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So this law passed last year House

Bill:

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I don't have it written down.

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Basically created a new penalty

for what they called impermissible

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occupation, which means like being

in Oklahoma illegally is what

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they're trying to say, right?

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I said there's some sort of

permission process, but they're

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trying to dance around undocumented

folks living in Oklahoma.

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And that basically, if you are

caught breaking any other law and

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then you are found to be here.

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Illegally, then there's

an additional consequence.

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The law this year would make that

a felony by itself, and the reason

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they have a law this year is that

the previous law, the one passed last

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year, 4156, has been on hold, right?

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A federal judge issued a stay last year

that said, hang on, like, this is perhaps

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unconstitutional or illegal in some way.

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So it cannot be enforced while

it goes through the process

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and that was filed by the U.

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S.

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Department of Justice last year

when Joe Biden was still president.

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As we have a new president now, a

new head of DOJ and the new DOG,

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excuse me, DOJ administration

has dismissed that case entirely.

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Which means that law can go into

effect as it was passed last year.

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Pending another sort of If there's

not another legal challenge filed,

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or some other stay put on it.

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As with legal stuff, there's

always something else coming.

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It also means that the fate of the

bill this year is somewhat in question.

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I would expect they'll probably still go

through with it, because I think they were

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aiming to clean up some of the language.

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Dealt with it before.

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But regardless, I wanted to update you.

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Don't you know that has passed?

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Or been dismissed, so that

it's free to be enforced.

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The AG's office here said that they were

reviewing it as well, and as far as they

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can tell, It just means that the federal

government is okay with it being enforced.

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I think they'll be looking to

take a look at it at the state

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level now, again, as well.

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And then for my own piece,

right, this is Andy's commentary.

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I think this is dumb.

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This, not this issue necessarily,

but like, this bill necessarily,

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but this issue more broadly,

that like, the partisanship of

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law, which I know is a thing.

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And it's annoying because when we, the

public, start to realize that what is

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considered legal or illegal varies quite

widely by political winds, right, by

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who's in the White House or who's in the

governor's mansion or like who's in power,

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if it means that the law does not stand

on its own, and that erodes the public's

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trust in institutions a great deal, right?

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Even if we were to take something as

simple as a speed limit, and let's

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say speed limits were 55 miles an

hour when Republicans are in charge

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or 70 miles an hour when Democrats

are in charge, it would be absurd for

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us to think that we have to drive a

certain speed just because someone's.

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In charge, in a state, right?

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That could vary state to state,

that could vary city to city.

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And it could also like what if

they don't replace all the signs?

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That's a big expense if they do it.

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There's all these like

trickle down effects of that.

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And that would be ridiculous.

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Because it would just tell us that it is

not based on science or safety standards.

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It is based on politics.

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And I think most people feel like

that's a dumb way to govern, right?

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That there should be, we understand that

there's a certain amount of partisanship

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that is inherent in the system that might

flavor priorities or some like funding

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decisions, and maybe even some tax

policy, like there's some element of it.

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But now in this modern world

where everything top to bottom is

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completely tainted in partisanship.

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Red or blue, there is very

little room for anything that is

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in between or outside of that.

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If one party is for something,

the other party necessarily feels

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like they must be against it.

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There's very little overlap where

both groups are for something or

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both groups are opposed to something.

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Then it makes it really hard for all of us

in the world to like find our way through.

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And so in this, going back

to this example, right, like

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the idea that someone's.

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I think most people would agree, right?

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If there's, if someone is in the

country and has come here not through

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the prescribed channels, like they are

here in a undocumented or illegal way,

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not that they as a person are illegal,

that's a whole other conversation, but

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like their presence here was outside

the prescripted method in the law.

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Like, I think most Americans agree

like, okay, well, that's not ideal.

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And that's like arguably even wrong.

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Or like, okay.

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And then you have an option of

like, well, what's the problem here?

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Is it the fact that they are here?

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Is that the problem?

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What if they're working and

paying taxes and raising a family

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and contributing to society?

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Like their presence might be

great and in many cases is.

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The problem then is not on the

individual, but on the system

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that forced them to end up here.

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In this method, right?

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Many, most, I don't know, I haven't

started, but many immigrants, I'll

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say most immigrants, want to come

to America to have a better life.

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Isn't that the whole thing?

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It's like inscribed on

the Statue of Liberty.

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This is a whole thing.

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America is a melting pot, and we

have celebrated that for 200 years.

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Our immigration system

right now is a Messed up.

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And we're not alone.

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A bunch of countries, like most Western,

civilized, industrialized countries,

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like, are experiencing this problem with

immigration that they haven't figured

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out how to wrap their head around

because it has become an intractable

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problem where neither party wants to

collaborate or compromise with the

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other to make a solution that's workable

that actually addresses the problem.

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Even, last year or the year before last

Oklahoma Senator James Lankford like

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proposed an immigration reform bill that

was, had bipartisan support, but went down

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in flames because someone who was not yet

the president, Trump, was out of office

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and he said he didn't like it and that

tanked the bill from outside the Capitol.

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And so When problems like this that

do have bipartisan support towards

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solutions, not even great solutions, just

like a temporary partial solution had

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bipartisan support, and some dude who is

not in office of any kind can sink it,

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our incentives are misaligned, right?

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Politicians are governing or attempting to

govern, perhaps for right reasons, right?

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But they're being incentivized

to do it for wrong ones, right?

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And often, those wrong ones are

simply just getting re elected.

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Like, when a politician's primary

goal is to get re elected and not

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to serve the people that they're

currently elected to serve?

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This is, we've put the emphasis

on the wrong syllable, right?

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There's something here that they are

rewarding, that we are rewarding.

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That is not what most people want.

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Most people want government to function so

well that we never have to think about it.

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And that is clearly not the

way things are going right now.

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Speaking of changes to federal policy,

the, also this week, the Oklahoma

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Insurance Commissioner, Glenn Mulready,

who most of us forget exists as an

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individual, but as a position, like

I forget the insurance commissioner

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is on a statewide elected official,

they'll be on the ballot next year.

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It's someone we'll be electing next year.

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He issued a warning, or like more of

a heads up this week to Oklahomans

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who have health insurance through the

marketplace, the Affordable Care Act,

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Obamacare, whatever you want to call it.

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Premiums, the part you pay each month,

are very likely to increase dramatically

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next year if the federal enhanced advanced

premium tax credits aren't extended.

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Okay, so let me break this down.

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The ACA was passed years ago, right,

under Obama, and rolled out slowly

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across America, not without some

hiccups, but it's been in effect

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for quite a while now, right?

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More than 10 years, I think.

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And in Oklahoma, there's like 300, 000

Oklahomans that have health insurance

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they buy through the marketplace,

right, through the Affordable Care Act.

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And just like any insurance, there's

a monthly premium you have to pay.

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During the pandemic the federal

government, as part of their

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big stimulus aid bills, included

basically a discount, right?

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They said, we're gonna reduce

premiums for everybody on

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Marketplace by a substantial amount.

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Because there's a lot of, economic

instability, a lot of uncertainty, people

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are losing jobs, everything was in chaos.

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And so the Fed said, we're

going to send you some checks.

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We're going to like, make this big

discount to make it easier to afford.

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So if you like, lose your job

or things change, maybe you

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can still keep bumping along.

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For most Oklahomans, like if you're

an average Oklahoman who has a silver

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plan through the marketplace, it's like

gold, silver, bronze, platinum, I guess.

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If you have a silver plan, which is like

a middle of the road, regular plan, Right

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now, your premium is around 58 a month.

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That includes this, like, extra discount.

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But, the pandemic ended.

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Things are back to normal ish.

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There's a new administration in town.

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And so, they're like, a

new congress is in town.

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They're saying, hey, we

gotta end these discounts.

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We've been given for several years,

because it's costing a lot of money.

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In fact, Cumulatively, this costs,

these extra discounts cost like 338

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:

billion, which is a lot of money.

367

:

But it's not going to nothing, right?

368

:

Like, it's helping pay for insurance.

369

:

For millions of people.

370

:

Like I said, in Oklahoma there's

300, 000, just in our little state.

371

:

And so if you are paying 58 bucks a

month and these discounts go away, it

372

:

means that next year your premium will

be something like 153 dollars a month.

373

:

So 100 bucks a month increase.

374

:

Which is a lot, right?

375

:

That's a lot for everybody.

376

:

Most everybody.

377

:

For sure everyone has

Marketplace insurance.

378

:

That's a lot of money.

379

:

That might mean that people

can't afford it anymore.

380

:

And so they drop their plan

and they don't have insurance.

381

:

And that sparks a whole other problem.

382

:

What I haven't heard yet is any

acknowledgement that a lot of the

383

:

politicians who fought against the

ACA are now fighting for it because

384

:

they don't want their constituents

to lose insurance coverage, right?

385

:

This idea suddenly that Congress

might end these discounts and throw

386

:

a bunch of chaos, a bunch of, and

effectively throw people off insurance,

387

:

right, by their own volition.

388

:

Force them off by higher prices means

that fewer people will have insurance.

389

:

And that is the kind of thing that

like, is a proper incentive, right?

390

:

Politicians should be incentivized to

make sure that their constituents are like

391

:

healthy and have some economic security

and aren't gonna go completely bankrupt if

392

:

they break their arm or toe or something.

393

:

So we'll see what happens.

394

:

They've got until December,

so we got a long time to go.

395

:

But it's going to be a tough deal.

396

:

Like, I mean, just financially

speaking, 338 billion is a lot of money.

397

:

Especially when it was like

designed to be temporary.

398

:

But as we know, the federal government,

there's a lot of stuff that is

399

:

passed in a temporary way that has

a magical way of becoming permanent.

400

:

So we'll see what happens with that.

401

:

And I think, again, this is Andy

talking, but Shouldn't we be talking

402

:

about single payer insurance again?

403

:

I know if you like your insurance

you should be allowed to

404

:

keep it, that's fine with me.

405

:

But like there's a bunch of other

countries, like most other countries

406

:

have figured this out decades ago.

407

:

That it is cheaper and more effective

for everybody to have just like one

408

:

nationalized system that everybody

has the same Health insurance, right?

409

:

Because right now with private

companies in there, these are

410

:

private for profit companies in

many cases, and that means that they

411

:

are incentivized to make a profit.

412

:

Which means they have to charge

you more than they pay out,

413

:

so that they have a profit.

414

:

And that means that we are paying

money in not to get benefits

415

:

back, but for shareholders

somewhere to get Wealthy, right?

416

:

Like this again, this changes

the incentives of how the

417

:

insurance company behaves.

418

:

And if those insurance companies

are paying lobbyists or giving

419

:

money to politicians to get them

reelected, it is creating a cycle.

420

:

That is just full of

misaligned incentives, right?

421

:

Politicians pass laws to ensure that

insurance companies can stay in place and

422

:

earn bigger profits, and then they use

those profits to give bigger checks to

423

:

politicians to get them re elected so that

they can ensure that insurance companies

424

:

make bigger profits, and they use those

profits to pay off politicians to pass,

425

:

like you see this cycle really easily.

426

:

That is nuts.

427

:

the kind of system that I want, right?

428

:

I want people to be able

to go to the doctor.

429

:

It is insane to me the amount

of money that we have to pay out

430

:

of pocket every month for health

insurance, whether you use it or not.

431

:

And then if you do use it, you still

have to pay out of pocket, right?

432

:

We've been trying to get my

daughter scheduled to have a

433

:

tonsillectomy for several months.

434

:

It was supposed to be last fall and then,

or last winter, and she got sick, and

435

:

so we had to reschedule for this year.

436

:

And we rescheduled it out far

enough because we needed some time

437

:

to try to reach our deductible.

438

:

And the and now it's been punted again,

and so we're still working on it.

439

:

But our decision is governed not

entirely by our daughter's health,

440

:

but like by financial consequences

for us, like trying to afford this,

441

:

which is not the way we should be

thinking about our health, right?

442

:

When we are constantly having

to think, how bad do I need this

443

:

preventative measure versus how bad

do I need this money to buy eggs?

444

:

And when that's the thing we're

all at home worrying about, Right?

445

:

Then we definitely are not, it

diminishes our bandwidth to worry

446

:

about big picture problems, right?

447

:

Threats to the First Amendment, threats

to democracy, or how elections happen,

448

:

how the initial petition happens.

449

:

Things that really do have a downstream

consequence for our lives, but when we

450

:

are forced to be distracted by the inane,

unnecessary, like, budgetary concerns of

451

:

fiscal policy from healthcare decisions

made a decade ago, and how it affects us

452

:

month to month now, it is understandable

that we might feel exhausted.

453

:

And in many cases, voters

decide to tune out, right?

454

:

I get it.

455

:

Alright, you may have pickered up

on the fact that this episode is

456

:

like two parts news updates, one

part Andy's rants about the system.

457

:

Righteous rants, I will

say, but rants nonetheless.

458

:

Speaking of threats to the initial

petition process, a bill was

459

:

passed in the Senate this week.

460

:

And this is spring break, they were

only in session for two days ironic

461

:

that they pushed through a nasty

bill when no one's paying attention.

462

:

And I haven't really talked

about this much on the show yet.

463

:

I've been trying to get some

people together to discuss it,

464

:

but we haven't got there yet.

465

:

Senate Bill 1027 would make sweeping

changes to the initiative petition or the

466

:

ballot initiative process in our state.

467

:

And I will begin, as I always do, by

reminding you that the right of the

468

:

people to petition their government

is the first right that is enumerated

469

:

in the Oklahoma State Constitution.

470

:

And that is not by accident, that is

by design, because the framers of our

471

:

Constitution knew that there would be

times in the history of our state where

472

:

we cannot and should not rely on our

elected officials to do the right thing.

473

:

There are, there will be times when

they will be unable or unwilling to

474

:

pass the laws that our people need

and demand, and we need to have a

475

:

mechanism to do that on our own.

476

:

Here we are.

477

:

I would argue it's more necessary now

than it's ever been because of how

478

:

deeply divided our state is, right?

479

:

That politicians who are in office are

not incentivized, as we just discussed,

480

:

to pass laws, in many cases, that are

actually to the benefit of the public.

481

:

of the public, and they are certainly

not incentivized on any level to pass

482

:

laws governing themselves, right?

483

:

This is why the legislature,

they opted themselves out of the

484

:

Open Record and Open Meeting Act.

485

:

This is why the legislature only seems

to propose restrictions on the people's

486

:

right to petition their government.

487

:

They never pass laws restricting

their own right to do that, right?

488

:

We've seen this slide over the

last, I don't know, decade or so.

489

:

Ballot initiatives are relatively

few and far between in Oklahoma

490

:

compared to other states that have it.

491

:

We might have one or two or three

on a ballot, every couple of years.

492

:

And sometimes, like last year,

there are some that are referred by

493

:

the legislature and those kind of

sneak in without people being aware.

494

:

When it's a campaign, when it's

truly a campaign of the people,

495

:

because that's a lot of work, right?

496

:

There's a lot of people involved.

497

:

You have to collect signatures,

you have to promote it, you have to

498

:

market it, you have to tell people

about it, you have to do months

499

:

and years of education around it.

500

:

And that's what's happened with

Open Primaries, which is one that's

501

:

going through the process right now.

502

:

I've been talking about Open

Primaries since at least:

503

:

Oklahoma Academy has been talking

about it for, since:

504

:

Oklahoma United has been talking

about it for several years.

505

:

Like this is not new.

506

:

No one's sneaking this in anywhere.

507

:

It is not even for sure on the ballot yet.

508

:

We got a long way to go.

509

:

Minimum wage is going to

be on the ballot next year.

510

:

Again, that campaign, long, arduous, lots

of like headlines, lots of legal battles.

511

:

It's a hard work to get

a question on the ballot.

512

:

Before that, we worked

on one for redistricting.

513

:

Of course, the pandemic happened and we

weren't able to complete that process

514

:

because we were all on lockdown.

515

:

Before that we had Medicaid expansion,

which is something that the legislature,

516

:

that's a great example, the legislature

spent 10 years talking about it.

517

:

The legislature even passed

it and enacted it into law and

518

:

the governor vetoed it, right?

519

:

This was not a new thing.

520

:

And it finally, when the legislature was

unable, first they were unwilling, and

521

:

then they were unable to get it done.

522

:

It went to the people

and the people did it.

523

:

It was at criminal justice reform,

but you've also had things that have

524

:

been championed by Republicans, right?

525

:

Right to work.

526

:

Right to farm.

527

:

That was more of a corporate

farming bill, not really a right,

528

:

but that's how it was marketed.

529

:

There were, there've been ballot

initiatives led by, we'll say

530

:

partisans or partisan esque

people on both sides of the aisle.

531

:

This is not a tool of the left.

532

:

This is a tool of the people.

533

:

And the legislature, in its infinite

wisdom, some members, are once

534

:

again taking aim at it in a way

that is harmful and unnecessary.

535

:

So, this bill, Senate Bill 1027,

would do a number of things, and

536

:

it's only halfway through, right, or

we'll say a third of the way through.

537

:

It's past the Senate, it's

gotta go to the House, and then

538

:

ultimately to the Governor's desk.

539

:

Some of the things it would do is that

it changes how signatures are collected.

540

:

So right now you have to have

a set number of signatures.

541

:

You collect them wherever you can.

542

:

Most campaigns go to all 77 states

because that's the way to do it, right?

543

:

That's the right way to do it.

544

:

That's what minimum wage did.

545

:

That's what Medicaid expansion did.

546

:

That's, we had a really, developed

field plan for redistricting

547

:

to go to every county.

548

:

You want that.

549

:

This would limit it so that you can

only have 10 percent of signatures

550

:

from Oklahoma and Tulsa County.

551

:

Those are, that is, counties

with 400, 000 or more people.

552

:

And then for all the other counties,

the other 75 counties, you can't have

553

:

more than 4 percent from any one county.

554

:

So you could theoretically not have to go

to every county to like meet this, but a

555

:

good campaign is going to every county.

556

:

We already do.

557

:

That's how you do it.

558

:

That's the right thing to do.

559

:

And that's how it happens.

560

:

It also adds some barriers to the process.

561

:

It like Blocks any out of state donations.

562

:

It also means you add some changes to the

gist, which is like the language that's

563

:

on the signature page when you sign.

564

:

You have to have, signature

collectors I think can't be out of

565

:

state, that they have name tags,

things that, again, we do right now.

566

:

It seems pretty clear that

this might be aimed at the open

567

:

primaries effort that's happening.

568

:

And I think that campaign is,

I've seen op eds from them,

569

:

they're certainly worried, right?

570

:

That if you change the process

midstream, that's not fair.

571

:

And might, should be illegal.

572

:

I don't know.

573

:

So, this bill goes over to the

House now, we'll see what happens.

574

:

Speaker Hilbert is one of

the authors over there.

575

:

There are several

authors in both chambers.

576

:

And so we'll see what happens.

577

:

It's a long road ahead, right?

578

:

There's still a lot of session left.

579

:

But it's, and I don't even know

if it's been assigned to a House

580

:

committee yet, but I would, if it's

something you're interested in, right?

581

:

Like, make your voice heard.

582

:

This is an important issue.

583

:

We'll send out some action

alerts about it soon.

584

:

Okay, that's it for a news roundup,

with, at least on the state level.

585

:

But this week in my weekly consumption

of podcasts and other political

586

:

media, there's been one thing that's

stood out to me from the rest,

587

:

and in some ways it's because it.

588

:

Isn't just on one outlet, right?

589

:

So there's a guy named David Shore,

S H O R he is head of data science

590

:

at an organization called Blue Rose

Research, which is a democratic

591

:

messaging firm, like the research firm.

592

:

They do tons of studies and

polling and all kinds of stuff.

593

:

I guess they're big.

594

:

I don't know.

595

:

I'm not a democrat.

596

:

But David Shore was on the Ezra Klein

show, which I listened to a little bit.

597

:

Fairly often, not every episode,

sometimes Ezra drives me nuts

598

:

as like a, coastal elite thing.

599

:

But if you Google David Shore, S H

O R, today, you'll see his Wikipedia

600

:

first, and then under the top stories,

there's one from Vox, the New York

601

:

Times, New York Magazine Center

for Economic and Policy, something.

602

:

Esquire Magazine the Breakthrough

Institute, just LinkedIn in

603

:

general a bunch of things.

604

:

And they are all about this guy

and his like new publication.

605

:

Young guy is like 33 which is humbling.

606

:

He's like 10 years younger than me.

607

:

But he has done.

608

:

His firm has done a ton of research about

what happened in the:

609

:

I think it's fascinating, regardless of

your party affiliation or non affiliation.

610

:

But I think data about

voters is fascinating.

611

:

Polling surveys about who we

are as Americans is fascinating.

612

:

I would I encourage you to

listen to it, or better yet,

613

:

watch it because he has slides.

614

:

And who doesn't want to sit around

at home watching a YouTube video

615

:

of some egghead talking about

political science with slides?

616

:

But the graphs are really excellent.

617

:

I will admit, I listened to

Ezra's podcast the other day while

618

:

we were doing some painting at

the, here in the Democracy Den.

619

:

And I got done.

620

:

I was like, shoot, I gotta

watch this whole thing again.

621

:

It's like an hour long because

I need to see the slides.

622

:

They tried to describe them, but as

I've talked to other people who watched

623

:

it, they said it's really compelling.

624

:

And I think Ezra's voice was pretty

clear that it was really compelling

625

:

to see some of these numbers.

626

:

And what's fascinating to

me is this shift, right?

627

:

So like, I'll just read you some of

the headlines about Shor's article.

628

:

From Vox, it says, this is why Kamala

Harris really lost, subheading,

629

:

TikTok is making young voters

more Republican, question mark.

630

:

And then New York Magazine, why non white

voters and young men drifted to Trump.

631

:

And then Esquire, when did we decide

that democracy and improving people's

632

:

lives contradicted each other?

633

:

This is a.

634

:

Another I think op ed piece.

635

:

Maybe it's not.

636

:

Anyway, that's basically

the theme of all of them.

637

:

And I think they're putting

too much emphasis on TikTok.

638

:

In some ways.

639

:

But they are right to point

out that the media environment

640

:

is super fragmented, right?

641

:

Those of you who listen to this show are

a select group of people who pay attention

642

:

to Oklahoma politics more closely than

probably any of your friends, right?

643

:

Each of our episodes gets about 3,

000 downloads in a month which is

644

:

way more than I would ever think.

645

:

And that's, I take that back.

646

:

Each episode probably gets 400

downloads in the first month, but we

647

:

have about 3, 000 downloads each month.

648

:

So like some people

listen to past episodes.

649

:

That sounds like a, that's a lot to me.

650

:

It's not like a murder podcast, but

in the scale of like, well, we've

651

:

got 3 million eligible voters,

it is a fraction of 1%, right?

652

:

The kind of people who vote,

especially in presidential elections,

653

:

are increasingly difficult to

quantify, or to even to qualify?

654

:

Quantify.

655

:

Because there's a lot of folks who are

likely voters, and then there's also an

656

:

increasing number of unlikely voters.

657

:

I think there's a Trump effect with this.

658

:

But a lot of this conversation is about

really how Democrats like lost their base

659

:

and like seem to like be unable to message

to even a lot of their own supporters or

660

:

more broadly to the electorate in ways

that they used to take for granted, right?

661

:

I'm thinking back to 2008.

662

:

And hope and change and Obama's first

term and there was like this sentiment

663

:

then that like, Oh, Democrats are going

to have a majority for the next 50 years.

664

:

Like we've crushed it, we really,

we've unlocked the potential.

665

:

And then eight years later, Trump

was elected and Democrats were

666

:

like, what the heck happened?

667

:

I think Democ or Republicans are

struggling with this in their own way

668

:

as well, and that's a conversation for

another day, but I would encourage you

669

:

just to watch the conversation around

issues like open primaries, right?

670

:

Where there is a fraction or a faction

of the Republican base, especially

671

:

politicians who are more interested

in holding on to power and appealing

672

:

to a smaller group of voters than

what used to be the case in the party.

673

:

But Democrats, there's a trope,

right, about Democrats in disarray.

674

:

Even if you watch the West

Wing, they make jokes about it.

675

:

President Bartlett makes jokes in,

I think, season six or season seven,

676

:

about the media loving to write stories

about Democrats being in disarray.

677

:

And I would say that's probably

why David Shore has been so

678

:

widely publicized this week.

679

:

But also, he's got good data.

680

:

And it really is fascinating.

681

:

I think As I've told a couple of friends

this week, I think part of the issue

682

:

in my mind is that a lot of the thing,

this is my own term, but I'm gonna, I'm

683

:

gonna coin it here on the show, that I

think we think about Republicans being

684

:

supportive of an American first policy,

especially like in foreign policy, right?

685

:

But focusing on what's good

for America first, and then

686

:

worry about other countries.

687

:

down the road.

688

:

And while I take issue with that in a

number of ways, I think what Democrats

689

:

miss out on is not America first, but

it's like an American hedonism, right?

690

:

Like a pleasure principle of

what it means to be an American.

691

:

And they haven't, they're like aloof

in a way that makes it difficult.

692

:

And I don't know if this is like the

Coastal elite bias of the Democratic

693

:

Party, or this like, education gap that is

often discussed, including on this episode

694

:

with David Shore and Ezra Klein, or what.

695

:

But Republicans figuring out how

to connect with regular, everyday

696

:

folks in a way that is easier,

or at least more successful.

697

:

Sometimes it's because they're

just telling them what they want to

698

:

hear, and they know they're lying

about it, and that's problematic.

699

:

From like a truth standpoint, but

if you just care about electoral

700

:

outcomes, seems to be working.

701

:

But then other stuff that I think

the left will write off, right?

702

:

Like Trump going to the Daytona 500 and

going to like sporting events like that.

703

:

All I heard from Democrats or I read

online would be people like, Oh,

704

:

this is costing so much money and

oh, what a hassle for everybody.

705

:

I was like, yeah, it is.

706

:

But it's also pretty cool if you're

at an event and the president comes.

707

:

Right?

708

:

It might be a hassle, sure, especially

if you don't like the president, but if

709

:

you do, or you're neutral about it, you

don't really care, it's still cool to

710

:

be in an event where the most powerful

person in the world is also there, right?

711

:

To be like, oh wow, they're a

celebrity, I saw them, they're

712

:

the president, that's cool.

713

:

And I think that, like, simple explanation

connects with people in ways that

714

:

esoteric, complicated policy does not.

715

:

To connect with what we said about

healthcare earlier, a joke that

716

:

I said to Scott the other day was

Americans say we want universal

717

:

healthcare, but what Americans

really want is a Bud Light, right?

718

:

Like there's like a, and I know that's

reductionist and also like not accurate

719

:

for everybody, but you probably

also chuckled a little bit, right?

720

:

Because is that solving healthcare

is a huge problem, a huge Yeah.

721

:

Complicated system that's very difficult,

and it's much easier to be like, Hey

722

:

man, let's just sit down and have a beer.

723

:

And that feels relaxing, and

that feels like a relief.

724

:

And that is the kind of

government that people want.

725

:

A government that they

don't have to worry about.

726

:

They're just like, hey, man, this

shit's hard, but he's got my back,

727

:

and I got a cold one, so, that's okay.

728

:

And I'm not arguing that we

should all be that way, right?

729

:

We should not all give up or be simple,

but I do think that anyone who cares about

730

:

public policy on any side of politics

needs to be more intentional about how

731

:

we meet people where they are, right?

732

:

Maybe that's just like, and I think

in many cases that is just showing

733

:

up and being present and not come in.

734

:

Necessary with a slide deck, not coming

with a fancy, polished presentation.

735

:

But it's about building real

relationships, and talking to people

736

:

for who they are, and accepting them

for who they are, even when it's ugly.

737

:

A little rough around the edges.

738

:

Right?

739

:

I know I say this all the time, but,

again, to reference the West Wing,

740

:

There's a tremendous scene, right,

where Toby says that government, for

741

:

all its failings in the past and for

those yet to come, Is a force for good.

742

:

And I think that's what

most people really want.

743

:

If you really push them.

744

:

They don't want it to go away.

745

:

Entirely.

746

:

They want it to like, get out of the way.

747

:

We don't want to have to worry about

saying the wrong thing all the time.

748

:

Or fitting in.

749

:

I think that's the problem, right?

750

:

I think too often, at least

right now, Democrats have made

751

:

it more difficult to fit in.

752

:

to their group than Republicans have.

753

:

You can show up and be a hot mess,

and Republicans are like, come on in.

754

:

With Democrats, you gotta

be a little more refined.

755

:

And that is off putting to lots of people.

756

:

Like, I get it.

757

:

And on many cases, people are

not switching to Republicans,

758

:

they're switching to no party,

to being independent, or they're

759

:

opting out of the whole system.

760

:

They're saying, gross, I don't want

to have to work so hard to fit in,

761

:

but I also don't want to be down

here with everybody, this is like a

762

:

motley crew, I'm just gonna opt out.

763

:

And that, as I say almost every week, is

my biggest fear, right, that a smaller

764

:

and smaller percentage of the American

electorate will actually participate.

765

:

Thankfully, it's not, so far

it's not the case, right?

766

:

So far, people are actually

tuning in and showing up, at

767

:

least at presidential elections.

768

:

But we hope that it happens in

down ballot races as well, right?

769

:

That we need people to be

tuned in, to pay attention.

770

:

And we, I argue, we need people to be

smart and to be thoughtful and to do

771

:

the hard thing, which is to care about

how you're showing up a little bit.

772

:

Or at least, like, read, you don't have

to like read the whole chapter, but

773

:

you gotta read the bold print vocab

words before something like, you gotta

774

:

know how things work a little bit.

775

:

Because if we expect government to

just be a, Ronco, set it and forget

776

:

it kind of thing that we don't ever

participate in, then we're not doing

777

:

the maintenance required to make

sure it's still running properly.

778

:

So you gotta pay attention to some.

779

:

But I do think that if you are someone

listening to this and you do any kind

780

:

of community organizing, and this I'm,

I will acknowledge I am talking to

781

:

myself right now you would be amazed

at the piles of notes I have about

782

:

This that we're trying to incorporate

into our work, but like, we have to

783

:

think about how we're showing up and how

we're expecting others to show up to, and

784

:

I, we're not, this is not a reality show.

785

:

We're not trying to, or

it's not like a production.

786

:

It really is the most basic

of human skills and that's

787

:

connecting with one another.

788

:

So.

789

:

I'm going to walk around with my

head thinking about what Americans

790

:

think we want as universal health

care, but what most Americans

791

:

really want is just a Bud Light.

792

:

In the moment you want to argue about

the quality of Bud Light versus a local

793

:

craft beer, you have lost them, right?

794

:

I, that's how it goes, right?

795

:

You're speaking to a select crowd, but

in general, right, that's not the point.

796

:

The point is, Americans

want to take a deep breath.

797

:

Everything is hard.

798

:

Everything is hard right now.

799

:

Things are expensive.

800

:

People are worried about

their jobs and their kids.

801

:

They are worried about health care.

802

:

They're worried about going broke.

803

:

They're worried about the retirement

accounts that are, have lost a big

804

:

chunk in the last couple of weeks.

805

:

There's an immense amount of

uncertainty in the future.

806

:

The Fed is holding the rates steady

because they're uncertain about things.

807

:

Like, there's a lot of stuff going

on in the world right now, right?

808

:

Are we going to annex Canada?

809

:

Are we going to be at war with Canada?

810

:

What's going to happen with the future?

811

:

There's a really good episode of

Freakonomics the other day talking

812

:

about the the future impact of the

national debt and deficit, and how

813

:

that's The Wharton School of Business

tried to create a financial model, like

814

:

a computer model to estimate how big the

national debt will be in like 30 years

815

:

and the model broke because basically

under our current economic status our

816

:

government will fall apart before,

within 30 years if we don't fix things.

817

:

So like, shit is bad.

818

:

Things are not good right now.

819

:

We've got some real

problems we need to solve.

820

:

And because of that, we have to be

intentional about how we approach them.

821

:

And step one is like

getting everybody on board.

822

:

And that means we gotta be a little more

accepting of who is coming in the room

823

:

and just celebrate that they're there.

824

:

We can work on refining things later,

but we need everybody in the room.

825

:

And if you're gonna, if we're gonna

be at the door, Like a bouncer and

826

:

keeping out a whole bunch of folks

that want to be in the room really bad.

827

:

We are limiting our success,

like from step one, step two is

828

:

educating all those people on the

problem and the solutions, right?

829

:

Step three is making some action

plans for how we're going to implement

830

:

the solutions that we've identified.

831

:

That's a step.

832

:

Okay.

833

:

Well, that really ended

up on a rosy note, right?

834

:

Great.

835

:

Thanks.

836

:

Thanks for being here.

837

:

Like, thanks for listening.

838

:

Thanks for being willing to stand

in uncomfortable spaces with us, to

839

:

wrestle with difficult issues with us.

840

:

Thanks for listening to

my voice for an hour.

841

:

That's not how you want to spend

your week every week, I don't think.

842

:

Hey, friends, regardless of what

kind of beer you like to drink or

843

:

don't like to drink, if you don't

like beer, that's fine, right?

844

:

Let's find ways to show up for

one another this week, right?

845

:

Decisions are made by those who show up.

846

:

A great chance to get involved and to

dig a little bit deeper for all of us

847

:

is CivicsCon, which is coming up April

10th and 11th at Rose State College.

848

:

Go to civicscon.

849

:

com.

850

:

Get your tickets, they're just 25.

851

:

We're gonna have some big

announcements coming out in the

852

:

next few days with an agenda.

853

:

It's gonna be rad.

854

:

So if you're not on our mailing list

already, please go to letsfixthis.

855

:

org and sign up.

856

:

And then go to civicscon.

857

:

com to get your tickets.

858

:

Can't wait to see you there.

859

:

Until then, have a good weekend.

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About the Podcast

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Let's Pod This
Oklahoma politics for regular folks

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About your host

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Andy Moore

Andy is the CEO of Let's Fix This and Let's Fix This Votes.